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Miscellaneous items of interest.

Jen Hunter from Make me a Supermodel

I previously talked about Jen Hunter, the British grossly-obese-by-fashion world-standards contestant, who was the public favorite in the Make me a Supermodel contest but the judges’ nightmare.  Because of her refusal to diet, she impressed a mainstream modeling agency – Cape London Model Management – to sign her up.  This agency even managed to get her work as the face of Nokia (cellphones) and Avon (cosmetics), but no catwalk work, of course, and this eventually prompted Jen Hunter to quit the agency and join one for plus-size models, Excel Models, even though she is a size 12 (U.K.).

Heidi Klum stands up for the fashion industry

About a month ago, Heidi Klum defended the fashion industry against the charge that it promotes eating disorders in young women.  She noted: 

It’s up to the viewer to see it for what it is and to be realistic; not many people can look like this.

Everyone has to look in the mirror and say, ‘This is who I am’ and be happy.

Klum offered useless advice to teenage girls in the business: make it a point to eat healthily.  If they eat well, a number are bound to lose their jobs because of weight gain.

Here are the interesting passages from the report:

Klum herself came close to developing an eating disorder during the earlier stages of her modeling career. However, she claims that she never wanted to become skinny for the sake of competing against others on the catwalk, adding that the more she tried to lose weight, the harder it was to keep her mind off of food.

“They’d say, ‘You have to lose weight’, and I’d be like, ‘All I can think about is muffins!’ I wasn’t prepared to starve myself to be edgy,” Heidi Klum told People magazine last month. Now, she is among the World’s 15 highest-earning supermodels, according to Forbes magazine.

Heidi Klum admits, ‘“They’d say, ‘You have to lose weight’...’ and then tells the models to eat healthily!  What is this?  It isn’t the models’ fault.

Fashion creativity

Another example of the creativity that is observed in the fashion world:



You don't think "masculine" models to be in lingerie shows and beauty pageants but the fashion world is not allowed to have size requirements for their catwalks? Hypocrite.

Models have to be responsible for their own bodies. The fashion world sometimes pressures girls who already thin to lose more weight. The models have to decide if losing weight would possibly have a negative effect on their health and if they are willing to risk their health in exchange for more modeling opportunities. Heidi Klum is giving good advice by advising models to eat healthy. If you can't achieve or maintain the "ideal high fashion body" by eating healthily then you shouldn't be a high fashion model.

One shitty "fashion show" cannot be used as any kind of example of the entire fashion world. That no-name designer was trying to get attention. It didn't work because he is still a no-name. You should stop making generalizations about an industry you know very little about.

Danielle: Where have I suggested that the fashion world not be allowed to have a size requirement for the catwalk? I have noted that it is more convenient for fashion designers to have their models fit their designs rather than the other way around, i.e., one expects a restricted range of physique variation among them. What I have been focusing on is the observed range, not saying that there should be no range.

Heidi Klum's advice is useless. There are girls who need the money that modeling provides and/or want the fame that comes from modeling. It is for this reason that a number of girls will be prompted to undereat if doing so makes them suitable for fashion modeling. Heidi acknowledges the source of the pressure, but doesn't critique it, and makes it almost look like it is the fault of the girls.

It is normal for a human to eat ad libitum, i.e., in accordance with desire. People who have plenty to eat but are not eating enough are either suffering from mental illness, the proper advice for which is to seek psychiatric help, or being forced to undereat, the solution to which is to do something about the source of the problem, not say "eat well."

I have not used the video to represent the entire fashion world. It is one of many good example of the creativity that is observed in the fashion world.

I don't see the point of posting about the actions of Jen Hunter and calling her "grossly-obese-by-fashion-world-standards if you didn't want to criticize the fashion industry's size requirements.

I don't think Heidi was "blaming" anyone. She was aknowledging that it is the models who are ultimately in charge of their own bodies. If the model is underage then her parents have a huge responsibilty for making sure that their daughter is healthy. If the model is unable to meet industry standards in a healthy way then she shouldn't model. She has to look for employment elsewhere if she don't want to risk her health. If she feel that the money and the "fame" is worth risking her health then that's her decision.

That video is NOT a good example of the creativity of the fashion world. The guy didn't actually design anything. The models are wearing pasties and bits of some halloween costumes. That's not creativity that's gimmickry. This is a good example of the creativity of the fashion world.

The link didnt work . Here is a better link:

> You should stop making generalizations about an industry you know very little about.

Uh... Danielle, hunny...

Alexander McQueen is one of the Bad Guys:

"Jeffreys argues that many male fashion designers are "projecting their misogyny on to the bodies of women", and gives examples of collections featuring images based on sexual violence - Alexander McQueen's show for his masters degree was entitled Jack The Ripper, and depicted bloodied images of Victorian prostitutes. A later show in 1995, Highland Rape, featured staggering, half-naked, brutalised models. And John Galliano, in his 2003 collection for Christian Dior, Hard Core Romance, used the imagery of sadomasochism, putting his models in seven-inch heels and rubber suits "so tight they had to use copious amounts of talcum powder to fit into them"."

Oh well.
Looks like you don't know neither your Feminism nor your Fashion.
What a phony, this Danielle blowhard.

Der Arschloch, Alexander McQueen is not my enemy. I know that narrow-minded simpletons like yourself have a hard time comprehending that the words of a few people from a minority group cannot be used to reflect the thoughts and opinions of all or even most of the members of that group. I don't know where I have ever described myself as a feminist on this site. Your poor reading comprehension skills must have made you come to that conclusion. I know that you like to post links and quotes from other sources instead of making your own arguments but try arguing for yourself for a change. At least you would be better able to post relevant, useful information . Please stop embarrassing yourself, asshole.

I have not seen any videos or images from McQueen’s "Jack the Ripper" show. The images and videos I have seen from his "Highland Rape" show did not impress me. I believe it was his second collection and I think he has grown since then. He has explained that he was trying to depict the rape of Scotland by the English. He provided a likely excuse but I agree that the Highland Rape show had misogynistic elements. I don't really care. I am not going to lose sleep over an old fashion collection that hardly anyone knows or gives a shit about.

McQueen’s 2001 spring/summer collection is still a great example of the creativity of the fashion world regardless of his past work. He is still one of the most creative fashion designers of today. His work is amazing.

You don't know anything about feminism or fashion so stfu.

Der Wanderer: That was a good one. Sexual sadomasochism is a mental illness that is much more prevalent among homosexuals and bisexuals. You have these mentally ill S&M homosexual designers include elements of torture/violence/subjugation in their presentations and feminists blame heteropatriarchy for it!

Danielle: Der Wanderer didn’t accuse of you being a feminist or else why would he say that it appears that you don’t know much about feminism?

To understand why I posted the Jen Hunter update, you have to read the previous article on her, which sharply contrasts the public’s preferences with that of the homosexual designers’.

Heidi Klum didn’t explicitly blame anyone, but her advice to teenage models comes close to making it look like these models are at fault. Heidi Klum herself was forced to diet early on in her career and she expects other girls to eat well? You ignore the temptation of money and fame or the necessity of money in a number of cases. If a girl can do high-fashion modeling provided that she lost some weight, some will starve themselves for the money and/or fame.

The video I posted is a good example of the fashion world’s creativity, which isn’t just limited to the designs, but also involves the presentation.

Erik, I never pretended to know all there is to know about feminist theories but unlike you and Der Arschloch I don't pretend to know everything about feminism and I don't misrepresent their arguments in order to make lame points.

Yes, most designers would not include a girl of size four and certainly not over size six for their regular shows. You have made the point that homosexual designers prefer a level thinness for their runway models that most people find unattractive. I don't see how you're any different from them because you want girls with skinny waists even if everyone and their dog preferred skinny waists rather than thick ones.

I never ignored the temptation of money and "fame". It is up to adult women to decide whether or not they are willing to risk their health in pursuit of a career. Many people who make their livings off of their bodies have to make that choice. Athletes, dancers, models even prostitutes have to decide between possibly making more money and keeping their bodies safe and healthy. I don't know how old Heidi was in the earliest stages of her modeling career but if she was an adult then you certainly cannot say that she was "forced" to diet.

I am not saying that any of this is fair but what is your alternative? If the fashion world started to follow your rigid dictates then girls who looked like Heidi wouldn't have a snowball's chance in hell of becoming a model. They couldn't even dream of walking down a runway. At least your "feminine" (average) looking models can get some "work" flashing their genitals and conventionally attractive people are often used as catalog models.

That video is an extremely poor example of the creativity of the fashion world. There is absolutely nothing special about the venue or the walks and poses of the models. You are making it even more obvious that you don't have a clue what artistry and creativity is.

You are a homophobic asshole. The designers are probably saner than you are. At least they don't have the delusional belief that posting images of ugly naked women next to glamorous models will inspire people to change their views of a billion dollar industry.

You obviously think you are better than gay people and men who “narrowly escaped homosexuality”. You think white features > non-white features and you believe that everyone including non-whites share this belief. You demonize people who disagree with you. Why should anyone listen to an asshole like you? You suck.

Danielle: No one is saying that you have pretended to know all there is about feminist theories, but your poor understanding of some of the basics of feminism is something of interest. I am not a scholar of feminism myself, but I believe that I have a decent grasp of Feminism 101.

It is futile to argue that I am as bad as the homosexuals when it comes to runway models. I have already explained that one cannot indulge in negative health behaviors to acquire feminine beauty as opposed to dieting or excessive exercise that may be prompted by exposure to thin high-fashion models. I also do not have a problem with alternative fashion industries. The homosexuals can have their own fashion industry for all I care if there is a feminine beauty high-fashion alternative and hopefully a fashion alternative that uses closer to ordinary looking women. My argument isn’t that only my preferred type should be working as fashion models.

My solution to the thinness problem is straightforward. Basically, educate the public so that at-risk-for-anorexic-behaviors girls and women understand the reasons behind the looks of high-fashion models, and force the homosexuals to prove that their thin models are healthy and not dieting.

Heidi was around 18, I believe, when she was discovered. She was obviously forced to starve, which she has admitted. She wouldn’t have voluntarily done it, but had to do it for her career. She was big boned and wide-hipped and wasn’t going to be a big-name high-fashion model, and so she didn’t push herself too much. She was just lucky to end up in Sports Illustrated and as a Victoria’s Secret model, and thereby achieve stardom.

What do you mean there is nothing special about the Stefane Monzön pubic hair show? Do you not see the creativity oozing out of the presentation?

You are the one who is misrepresenting me but accuse me of misrepresenting feminism. I haven’t argued that I am better than homosexuals or men who have narrowly escaped nonheterosexuality. I am just glad that I am not either type. I have also clearly argued that the physical attractiveness of individuals from different ethnic groups cannot be objectively compared. The point about non-European preference for face shape was that they prefer more overall derived than average features for their group, which translates to closer to European norms, but this should not be confused with/described as a preference for more European facial features since there are European features that non-Europeans do not necessarily appreciate such as thinner lips or pale skin. Am I demonizing you/other critics or are you demonizing me?

Erik, I don't have a poor understanding of any of the "basics" of feminism. Unlike you I understand that many people who identify themselves as feminists have widely different opinions on what constitutes as oppression and they have different opinions on sex, pornography, science, politics and everything under the sun. You have a poor grasp of everything Erik so please don't try to insult anyone on that basis.

Women can indulge in negative behaviors because of the desire to be "feminine". They may not be able to achieve your ideal without major surgery but they will still feel bad about not looking like your nude skanks. Most women do not diet in order to look like high fashion models anyways.

You are completely delusional if you believe that an "alternative" fashion industry will arise based on model selection. Models are not that important Erik. If the designer’s clientele respond more favorably to having skanks on the runway then the designers will put skanks on their runways. You don't seem to understand that these designers are running a business. They are running businesses focused on providing luxury goods not on jack off material for losers and self esteem bolstering for the average woman.

If these young girls who are at risk for anorexia are being inspired by any public figures its not the high fashion models but the ultra thin celebrities. You have no proof that the thinness of these celebrities is directly or even indirectly influenced by high fashion models. You have formed hypotheses that sound good in your head and attempted to present them as fact. The fashion designers do not own the models who walk in their shows or star in their campaigns. They have no responsibility towards the health of these models.

Heidi was an adult when she started so she could not be forced to do anything. She made a decision based on her perceived options. She was not forced to pursue a high fashion career she WANTED to pursue a career in modeling.

I know that you posted that video as a lame attempt at mocking the fashion industry but you failed. That Stefane Monzon presentation was not a fashion show. You said it yourself it’s a pubic hair show.

You characterize high fashion designers as mentally ill, sadomasochistic pederasts but you claim that you are not demonizing them? Oh please!!! Anyone with a brain can tell that you are a homophobic white supremacist nut job so cut the crap Erica.

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